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Racing drivers' insurance - galileo

Just been watching the I o M TT highlights and wondered how these riders (and professional race drivers) manage insurance for their everyday road vehicles?

Obviously the likes of Lewis Hamilton can afford to self insure (he may have a clean licence and full no claims but has had accidents on tracks) but insurance for public roads for some of the bikers/rally drivers/saloon car racers I'd expect to be higher than average. (Or do insurers assume greater skill and therefore lower risk?)

Racing drivers' insurance - Ian_SW

Strangely enough, professional race drivers don't feel the need to race when driving normally on public roads!

Their insurance will probably be a bit higher than someone in a normal 9-5 office job, but no higher than a professional golfer, tennis player etc., where insurers see their odd hours and higher than average mileage as a higher risk.

For the amateur racers, which is the bulk of people you see racing, the insurance probably won't even know they are a racing driver. I've never seen any question about what I do in my spare time on a car insurance application.

Racing drivers' insurance - galileo

Strangely enough, professional race drivers don't feel the need to race when driving normally on public roads!

Their insurance will probably be a bit higher than someone in a normal 9-5 office job, but no higher than a professional golfer, tennis player etc., where insurers see their odd hours and higher than average mileage as a higher risk.

For the amateur racers, which is the bulk of people you see racing, the insurance probably won't even know they are a racing driver. I've never seen any question about what I do in my spare time on a car insurance application.

When filling in an application for insurance, how would you answer the "have you had any accidents in the last five years", if you had in fact had accidents on a track?

Knowing how some insurers will try to wriggle out of paying on the grounds of "non-disclosure" this was what set me thinking (you yourself may never have had any accidents on track so a hypothetical question for you)

Racing drivers' insurance - Middleman

Obviously the likes of Lewis Hamilton can afford to self insure...

It's unlikely that they do.

In the UK, to provide exemption from the requirement to have Third Party insurance, one has to deposit £500,000 with the Accountant General of the Senior Courts. This sum is per vehicle and it has to be actually lodged (rather than promised). This only provides such exemption in the UK.

A person of considerable wealth (as they would have to be to be able to lodge such a sum) would probably want to drive a number of vehicles and possibly in a number of countries. It is unlikely that Lewis Hamilton's advisors would encourage him to tie up what would probably be quite a few £millions in such a scheme. Further than that, if he managed to knock a budding corporate lawyer off his bike leaving him disabled for life, his £500,000 may not be anywhere near sufficient.

Racing drivers' insurance - galileo

Obviously the likes of Lewis Hamilton can afford to self insure...

It's unlikely that they do.

In the UK, to provide exemption from the requirement to have Third Party insurance, one has to deposit £500,000 with the Accountant General of the Senior Courts. This sum is per vehicle and it has to be actually lodged (rather than promised). This only provides such exemption in the UK.

A person of considerable wealth (as they would have to be to be able to lodge such a sum) would probably want to drive a number of vehicles and possibly in a number of countries. It is unlikely that Lewis Hamilton's advisors would encourage him to tie up what would probably be quite a few £millions in such a scheme. Further than that, if he managed to knock a budding corporate lawyer off his bike leaving him disabled for life, his £500,000 may not be anywhere near sufficient.

I thought that some Police Forces 'self insured', obviously not at £500k per vehicle. Or do they only take out third party fleet insurance and pay for their own repairs/write-offs?

Racing drivers' insurance - alan1302

When filling in an application for insurance, how would you answer the "have you had any accidents in the last five years", if you had in fact had accidents on a track?

Knowing how some insurers will try to wriggle out of paying on the grounds of "non-disclosure" this was what set me thinking (you yourself may never have had any accidents on track so a hypothetical question for you)

If they have not had an accident on a public road then they would say they have not had any the same as anyone else.

Racing drivers' insurance - P3t3r

As somebody else has suggested, I think a lot of the pros take it steady on the public roads. They appreciate that the public roads are different and don't go around every corner sideways. However, if things do go wrong, then their knowledge and experience would probably help them.

I could be wrong but I don't think accidents on a track would count on your normal car insurance.

Nigel Mansell has been the president of the IAM for a number of years. I suspect that he drives quite well/safe.

Racing drivers' insurance - galileo

As somebody else has suggested, I think a lot of the pros take it steady on the public roads. They appreciate that the public roads are different and don't go around every corner sideways. However, if things do go wrong, then their knowledge and experience would probably help them.

I could be wrong but I don't think accidents on a track would count on your normal car insurance.

Nigel Mansell has been the president of the IAM for a number of years. I suspect that he drives quite well/safe.

A number of race and rally drivers in recent years have been done for speeding, so they are not all that careful, are they?

Racing drivers' insurance - alan1302

As somebody else has suggested, I think a lot of the pros take it steady on the public roads. They appreciate that the public roads are different and don't go around every corner sideways. However, if things do go wrong, then their knowledge and experience would probably help them.

I could be wrong but I don't think accidents on a track would count on your normal car insurance.

Nigel Mansell has been the president of the IAM for a number of years. I suspect that he drives quite well/safe.

A number of race and rally drivers in recent years have been done for speeding, so they are not all that careful, are they?

Those ones weren't but other will be - racing drivers are no different from anyone else...some stick to the rules some won't

Racing drivers' insurance - P3t3r

As somebody else has suggested, I think a lot of the pros take it steady on the public roads. They appreciate that the public roads are different and don't go around every corner sideways. However, if things do go wrong, then their knowledge and experience would probably help them.

I could be wrong but I don't think accidents on a track would count on your normal car insurance.

Nigel Mansell has been the president of the IAM for a number of years. I suspect that he drives quite well/safe.

A number of race and rally drivers in recent years have been done for speeding, so they are not all that careful, are they?

A number of non-racing/rally drivers have also been done for speeding. You will always get people speeding and breaking the law, but I'm just not convinced that racing pros are any worse.

Racing drivers' insurance - TheGentlemanThug

I could be wrong but I don't think accidents on a track would count on your normal car insurance.

That's what I would have thought.

Racing drivers' insurance - Alby Back
A friend of my son is a semi-professional racing driver, he's only 19 but he has been quite successful in a minor sort of way.

Tangentially, his personal car is a Toyota IQ. I queried this choice given his background, but he says he prefers a low powered road car so he can drive it hard without too much risk to his licence.

He says his "normal" insurance is not affected by his career choice, but I suspect his occupation for that purpose is stated as "student" which is also true as he is also studying for a degree in engineering.
Racing drivers' insurance - Middleman

I thought that some Police Forces 'self insured', obviously not at £500k per vehicle. Or do they only take out third party fleet insurance and pay for their own repairs/write-offs?

They do neither. The same section of the RTA (S144) which provides for the £500k deposit also provides exemption from Third Party insurance requirements for, among others, local authorities and police forces. The fulll text can be found here under Section 144(2):

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/52/section/144

Racing drivers' insurance - galileo

I thought that some Police Forces 'self insured', obviously not at £500k per vehicle. Or do they only take out third party fleet insurance and pay for their own repairs/write-offs?

They do neither. The same section of the RTA (S144) which provides for the £500k deposit also provides exemption from Third Party insurance requirements for, among others, local authorities and police forces. The fulll text can be found here under Section 144(2):

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/52/section/144

Thanks for the clarification, much appreciated.

Racing drivers' insurance - Ethan Edwards

Even for us non racing drivers its very easy to acquire the "Getapushbike" points.

Rural roads festooned with Gatso's that constantly switch 40 to 30 to 40 to 30 to 40 etc in a very short distance..overgrown hedges covering signs....very easy indeed to get caught out.

Gatso's at the bottom of steep hills etc.

IMO it's beginning to verge on entrapment.

Racing drivers' insurance - skidpan

IMO it's beginning to verge on entrapment.

Drive at the limit (which unoficially allows 10% + 2mph) and you won't get caught.

All sensible people appear to undestand that carrying an illegal firearm is likely to get you into court and possibly prison simply because its against the law. But breaking the law in a car appears in many instances appears to be considered as OK by some people.

If you break the law expect there to be consequences.

Racing drivers' insurance - Middleman

IMO it's beginning to verge on entrapment.

We're straying somewhat off track but since you raised it, it’s quite clear you don’t understand the term “entrapment”.

Entrapment is where the authorities encourage or induce a person to commit a criminal offence which, without such encouragement, they would be unlikely or even unwilling to commit.

It is quite clear that in providing the sort of conditions you describe (changing speed limits, cameras, etc.) the authorities are in no way encouraging drivers to break the law. Quite the reverse, in fact; they are providing the conditions which should deter drivers from breaking speed limits.

Racing drivers' insurance - Manatee

Depends on your definition of induce. It certainly induces mistakes, and hence creates offences, even if it doesn't induce an intention to offend.

Perhaps it wouldn't meet the legal definition but it certainly results in people committing offences that they would not otherwise have committed.

It doesn't help that very few roads now seem to have sufficient repeaters where they are (or were) legally required.

Racing drivers' insurance - Middleman

"...but it certainly results in people committing offences that they would not otherwise have committed"

Bit of a strange argument. If there were no speed limits at all no speeding offences would be committed. One of the requirements of being competent to drive is being aware of the prevailing speed limit. I find it strange that many people will argue that it is perfectly safe to conduct a hands-free phone conversation but it is asking too much of them to recall what the last speed limit sign that they passed showed.