What is life like with your car? Let us know and win £500 in John Lewis vouchers | No thanks
3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - mikem004

What are your thoughts on the 3-cylinder engines used in small cars nowadays.

For example, the mk I Toyota Yaris had a 4-cylinder 1.0 engine. This was replaced in later models by a 3-cylinder engine with the same BHP.

Other manufacturers (VAG etc.) have done the same.

I suppose the 3-cylinder engines have good economy, and OK when new. But how do they fare after a few years and plenty of miles, when they have over 60k say on the clock?

I would expect a 3-cylinder engine to be revving and straining more than an equivalent 4-cylinder engine. But I could be wrong.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - Cyd

I see no reason a 3 cyl engine should not last as long as a similar 4 cyl.

My wife has a C1, 3cyl 1.0l, 45k miles and running fine.

My son has a Polo 1.2 3cyl, 102k miles and running fine

The C1 is dog slow, but that’s the measly 68hp, not the fact it’s 3cyl. The Polo is a better car to drive all round, but that’s because it’s larger capacity gives it more mid range.

I agree though, the C1 is great around town but we have to work it hard on the open road. Overtaking simply isn’t an option most of the time. This may have an effect on life, but not if otherwise driven sympathetically and well serviced (my Saab Aero is driven very hard – it’s on 104k, and my previous Rover 800 Vitesse Sport, 200PS Turbo was similarly driven hard and I sold it on at 187k to an ROC member who was chuffed to bits with it)

We are thinking of chopping in the C1 for a Clio 1.2 turbo though. Having recently driven my Saab for the first time, the Wife wants more oomph now!

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - P3t3r

My wife has a C1, 3cyl 1.0l, 45k miles and running fine.

The C1 is dog slow, but that’s the measly 68hp, not the fact it’s 3cyl. The Polo is a better car to drive all round, but that’s because it’s larger capacity gives it more mid range.

I agree though, the C1 is great around town but we have to work it hard on the open road. Overtaking simply isn’t an option most of the time. This may have an effect on life, but not if otherwise driven sympathetically and well serviced (my Saab Aero is driven very hard – it’s on 104k, and my previous Rover 800 Vitesse Sport, 200PS Turbo was similarly driven hard and I sold it on at 187k to an ROC member who was chuffed to bits with it)

We are thinking of chopping in the C1 for a Clio 1.2 turbo though. Having recently driven my Saab for the first time, the Wife wants more oomph now!

I also have a C1 at 54,000 miles. It hasn't had any issues and still sounds like new IMO. These engines like oil changes but that's because they have a chain cam. Being chain cam is brilliant IMO, changing belts is expensive and even more expensive if they break.

I disagree about the performance. While they certainly aren't in hot/warm-hatch territory, they are pretty good compared to other city cars. It's pretty torquey from idle up to high revs and it'll do 60mph in 2nd gear. However, I have heard some people say that the original ones (like I have) feel a lot faster than some of the more recent ones which are supposed to get an extra mpg, but I don't know whether that's true. Overall I think the engine is brilliant and even now, the fuel consumption (in the real world) is still among the best.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - Lrac

Agree 100% P3t3r. Only difference is mine is a 107. When I brought it I didn't even bother to drive it because I expected to be underwhelmed. I really enjoy driving it and love the basic nature.. It must be the easiest car ever to work on and parts cost peanuts.

I would never consider buying a car the size of a focus with a tiny blown 3 cylinder engine but thats simply based on personal prejudice.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - Lrac

accidentally submitted x2

Edited by Lrac on 09/03/2018 at 18:24

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - SLO76
No reason why they shouldn't last as long as 4cyl equivalents. They were introduced for the sake of economy and reduced emissions because there are fewer moving parts, less friction and they offer higher torque lower down the rev range than 4cyl engines of the same size.

The only worry is the added complexity from turbocharging where fitted, which can fail early if servicing is done on a shoestring or neglected altogether. They require good quality oil every year regardless of mileage.

Maintained correctly and they can cover big mileages as seen by VAG's 3cyl 1.2/1.4 diesels. These often pop up for sale with well over 150k, even the 3cyl petrol 1.2 is common with six figures as is the Aygo/C1/107 which many owners use as commuter cars.

They also have the added benefit of a lovely offbeat 3cyl thrum when thrashed. Even our Polo 1.2 TDI sounds quirky in a not unpleasant way. It pulls better than the 4cyl Peugeot 208 1.4 diesel we tested too.

Edited by SLO76 on 04/10/2016 at 13:48

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - SLO76
Further to that. I remember in the 90's some manufacturers offering small capacity 6cyl engines to compete with rivals with 4cyl's.

BMW's 2.0 6cyl, Nissan QX's 2.0 V6 and Mazda's 1.8 V6 being three which spring to mind. All were incredibly smooth and sounded lovely but they lacked the low speed torque of their 4cyl rivals and suffered far worse fuel economy.

Smaller more numerous cylinders make for greater refinement and a better balanced engine but hurt torque and economy.

Edited by SLO76 on 04/10/2016 at 13:56

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - joegrundy

" Mazda's 1.8 V6"

This brought back memories.

AS part of her mid-life crisis, my ex-wife #1 bought a Mazda MX6 (?) with the 1.8 v6 engine. Lovely car, great fun to drive.

Brought to a sad end, unfortunately, after some sad scuzzies stole the cat exhaust system.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - joegrundy

On a more prosiac note, I see from HJ's Paris Motor show reporting that Dacia are to introduce a 1.0 3 cyl 75bhp engine in their 'basic' car (currently the 1200 4 cyl 75bhp).

I'm a bit disappointed, to be honest, because I was hoping that they'd offer the 1.2 TCE turbo engine (as in the Duster) in the sandero/logan.

I don't know whether this 1.0 engine is used elsewhere? Any thoughts?

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - SLO76
It'll be a detuned version of the 900cc TCe already used in the Sandero. It's been in the Clio for a couple of years now but still a bit early to tell if it's got any inherent weaknesses unless anyone's heard differently? Renault can be a bit hit and miss on engine reliability. Their petrol engines are largely fine if serviced right and timing belts changed on schedule. The 1.5 diesel is fine too but the 1.9 is a pig and best avoided.
3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - SLO76

" Mazda's 1.8 V6"

This brought back memories.

AS part of her mid-life crisis, my ex-wife #1 bought a Mazda MX6 (?) with the 1.8 v6 engine. Lovely car, great fun to drive.

Brought to a sad end, unfortunately, after some sad scuzzies stole the cat exhaust system.

Be an MX3 with the 1.8 V6. It was an unusual wee car, silky smooth and fun. The MX6 had a 2.5 V6 and was another cracking coupe.
3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - Falkirk Bairn

MX3 - 1.8 V6 (MX3 auto was a 1.6l 4 cylinder)

MX6 - 2.5 V6

Mazda Xedos6 2.0 V6

Mazda Xedos9 2.3 & 2.5 V6 turbocharged

My Xedos6 bought in 1999 was" fault free" for 14 years

odd repair - brake calipers, suspension rubber, apart from that

repair free.

Sold it for £500 & it blew up 12 months & 20K later

The buyer did not service the car & it siezed

I had had the servicing done on the button - every 12 mths even

when the mileage was dropping from 10K to 5k per year.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - SLO76
Loved the Xedos 6. A pretty and quirky wee compact exec.
3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - Galaxy

Three cylinder engines are nothing new.

The Wartburg Knight had a three cylinder engine; how many of you remember those, I wonder?

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - gordonbennet

Three cylinder engines are nothing new.

The Wartburg Knight had a three cylinder engine; how many of you remember those, I wonder?

Yoo hoo.

My sister had a Knight, it went like hell, for its time a very quick car and benefitting from its excellent free wheel device, in pure acceleration terms it took a serious 4 stroke car to keep up.

I remember it fondly because it was the only car i've ever faced total brake failure with not on a banger track, fluid must have boiled on the dual carriageway and no brakes at all going down the slip road from the A1 into either Stevenage or Welwyn turns, luckily i've never been one to leave braking till the last moment and the handbrake proved good enough, brakes came back after a few mins and subsequently changing the fluid saw failure never reoccur.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - John F

Three cylinder engines are nothing new.

The Wartburg Knight had a three cylinder engine; how many of you remember those, I wonder?

These East German cars used the pre-war (and pre-Audi) DKW engine.

www.google.co.uk/search?q=dkw+3+cylinder+engine&am...A

If you are ever in Dusseldorf, go to the Classic Remise motor museum where they have an example on display. The distributor at the front has a fiendishly complex method of setting the points!

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - SteveLee

Three cylinder engines are nothing new.

The Wartburg Knight had a three cylinder engine; how many of you remember those, I wonder?

These East German cars used the pre-war (and pre-Audi) DKW engine.

www.google.co.uk/search?q=dkw+3+cylinder+engine&am...A

If you are ever in Dusseldorf, go to the Classic Remise motor museum where they have an example on display. The distributor at the front has a fiendishly complex method of setting the points!

My Mum had a Knight Estate - which I had the job of servicing, the reason they were so fiddly to setup right is they were effectively three single cylinder engnes bolted together - there were three ignition systems to maintain! I loved it though, I always meant to buy one to tune it and fit expansion chambers etc - by the time I got round to it, there were none left! My Mum's car met its demise rear-ending a Morris Minor - the was not a scratch on the Minor but the Wartburg disintegrated!

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - Squirrel tail

3 cylinder two stroke. Smelly things. As was the early Saab 93.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - Wackyracer

I thought the Polo 3 cylinder engines were notorious for burning out exhaust valves?

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - daveyjp

A family friend had a number of Wartburgs. He then moved onto Polski Fiats. The downside of being a left wing acitivist and living "the dream"!

Another friend took a smart Roadster Brabus to over 100,000 miles and it had been remapped to within an inch of its capabilities. He just used to change the oil twice a year to keep the turbo happy.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - Metropolis.

Was that the v6 that Mazda and Suzuki co-developed? The H engine i think its called. Had a 2.0, a 2.5 and after that Mazda withdrew but Suzuki continued it and made a lovely 2.7 v6. Drove a Suzuki XL-7 with it and 5 speed auto box derived from Toyota/Lexus.. went like S.... off a shovel! Popular as a crate engine for use in small planes apparently.

Edit: Just googled, yes it was. If Wikipedia is anything to go by...

"The H family is a line of 60° V6 automobile engines from Suzuki. Ranging in displacement from 2.0 L to 2.7 L, the H family was a modern all-aluminum engine with dual overhead cams, 24 valves, and multi-port fuel injection. It was co-developed with Mazda, which used a similar design in their 2.0 L KF V6. The H family was introduced in 1994 with the H20, but Suzuki and Mazda's designs diverged greatly with the former increasing displacement and the latter experimenting with alternative induction technologies and smaller engine sizes."

Edited by PCharlton on 04/10/2016 at 21:03

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - veryoldbear

I had a Saab 3 cylinder 2 stroke (I pint 30 grade per 4 gallons that's a quid guv). Went like stink (literally and metaphorically) and only a handful of moving parts ....

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - Wackyracer

Reading the last post on the 1.0T ecoboost thread this morning, it seems it could be a troublesome engine.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - SLO76

Reading the last post on the 1.0T ecoboost thread this morning, it seems it could be a troublesome engine.

Yeah, been reading that and doing a wee bit of digging. Seems early examples 12-13 are proving a bit soft. Ford better get on top of it or the reputation will be ruined same as the PSA 1.6 diesel in many Fords has been.
3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - mike hannon

I had a Wartburg Knight - still got the photos to prove it.

It certainly was an entertaining motor but a hell of a lot went wrong with it. One memorable day in the middle of Taunton the whole gear linkage fell through the floor.

I did give it a hard time though.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - Kevin Pharoah

Just sold our Audi A2 1.4 Tdi 3 cylinder (diesel engine) with 145K miles. we had it for 10 of its 14 years & had no problems with the engine at all.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - Steveieb
Am I right in thinking that the two stroke engines fitted to the Saab etc have two cycles for every one four stroke cycle? Hence they were smoother.
But every three cylinder car I have driven seem to be hard work to drive and at low revs you notice how unbalanced they are.
Worst of all is the Aygo, 107etc. And this is progress? I,d rather drive a seventies car like the Mk1 Golf!.
3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - John F

Apropos the 'why four cylinder' thread, have we an update on the best mass produced small 3-pot for longevity? Balance/vibration issues seem to have been solved, VW and Ford have chosen a life-long cambelt rather than chain, and Ford seems to have got on top of their ecoboost problems, regularly winning the 'International best sub-1.0l engine' award.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - SLO76
“Ford seems to have got on top of their ecoboost problems, regularly winning the 'International best sub-1.0l engine' award.”

Bearing in mind Mazda’s troublesome and horrendously thirsty rotary 1.3 also won this title as did BMW’s N47 2.0 diesel that’s murder for timing chain and turbo failure. Fiat’s 1250 diesel won in the economy engine category yet today has a terrible reputation for failure. Rovers K series won tonnes of awards when new yet went on to develop a terrible reputation for head gasket failure, particularly in 1.6 and 1.8 form. Awards like these mean little other than to tell us about how well these engines perform when spanking new, it doesn’t help us know which will be reliable In the longterm.

As for my favourite 3cyl motors well I love the offbeat engine note they make when extended and with fewer moving parts they’re cheaper to build, better on fuel and have less to go wrong. It’s a win win and I’m surprised they didn’t take off earlier, firms like Daihatsu proved they could be refined enough for superminis a long time ago. I’ve fond memories of the 3cyl Charade GTti and the amazingly frugal yet fun to drive 1.0 turbo diesel.

They’re still at it today with the 3cyl 1.0 in the C1/108/Aygo/Yaris being a Daihatsu design thanks to Toyota’s ownership of the firm. With regular oil changes these little chain driven motors will run and run. It’s unknown whether Ford really have rectified the 1.0 Ecoboost and it’s too early to tell with Vauxhall’s 1.0 Turbo or PSA’s 1.2.

Edited by SLO76 on 08/03/2018 at 11:20

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - SteVee

>>Am I right in thinking that the two stroke engines fitted to the Saab etc have two cycles for every one four stroke cycle? Hence they were smoother. <<

Yes, a 2-stroke fires at the top of every cycle, a 4-stroke fires at the top of every other cycle - so a 3-cyl 2-stroke can feel like a 6-cyl 4-stroke in power delivery (if not in balance terms). I remember being very suprised at how smooth a Wartburg 2-stroke was.

I don't see any reason why the 3 cylinder engines can't be as good as the fours. IT used to be too expensive to produce the 3-cylinder cranks rather than the flat-plane 4-cylinder cranks - I think there were some motorcycles that had 180-degree throws on 3 cylinder cranks, essentially missing a fourth cyclinder - was that the Laverda ?

Triumph make some loverly 3-cylinder engines.

3-cylinder engines: long lasting? - Auristocrat

The Toyota engine mentioned (1KR-FE), used in the Aygo/C1/107/108, Yaris, and some Daihatsus, Peroduas and Subaru's, seems pretty bullet proof. Early examples could suffer water pumps leaking, but otherwise are trouble free. One owner on the owners club, took a first generation up to 105,000 miles in under three years without any issues, has recently returned to a second generation after a period with other cars including BMW, and expects to do more miles in a similar timeframe.