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Please elaborate Smoothie.......has you car been stolen?
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Sometimes i wonder why i bother paying tax.
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Sometimes i wonder why i bother paying tax.
I know where you're coming from Jamie.......We often watch those Police.Camera.Action programmes, where you regularly see police chasing what they suspect to be a stolen vehicle, at high speed, across the county....and ultimately the copper chopper comes out to assist.
Seems strange that they know where my car is, and they wont go and get it ?
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Someone has an untaxed Ford Sierra somewhere and they send the entire force out in pursuit but you tell them where your stolen car is and they cant be bothered.
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the copper chopper comes out to assist.
Yes the certainly do titan at a cost of £1,500 per 15 minutes to us "tax payers", this I know being an aviator myself. None of it makes sense does it.???
I have had a reply today from my MP who says he is going to look into it. If he comes through he's got my vote. In my email I sent him I said I was not alone and that there are others around the country in the same situation. I suggest if you guys haven't done already, is to contact your local MP with your story and also say like I have that there are others in the same situation that have contacted their local MP, you never know it may create a bit of MP rivalry and competition amongst themselves to stand out as the MP who triumphs and saves the day who knows lol.
As soon as I get any info I will post it.
Also my brother has two friends in his cycling club that are in the police force and I have asked him if he would ring them to see if they may offer some assistants.
What many people don't realise is that because the police pass on the burden of motor vehicle theft to the insurance companies,and a direct result of this means we all suffer in the way of higher premiums when insuring our cars, not just for the people that have had to make a claim but for each and every person who has a car on the road and surely this is not fair as a result of the police failing or let's say even trying to recover a stolen car even when they know where it is.
If you car is stolen INFORM YOUR INSURANCE COMPANY, AND IF THE POLICE KNOW WHERE IT IS AND ARE RESISTANT TO RECOVER IT, TELL THE INSURANCE COMPANY "AND GET THEM TO FIGHT WITH OR FOR YOU" they actually do have a lot of clout as the last thing they want to do is pay you out.
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Innocent Smoothie Sadly welcome sounds like the rest of us that you have sadly got nowhere with the police. May I suggest you do what most of us have done contact you MP and tell him/her your story say there are others and let him/her know that basically the police have failed in their duty of care. The only way any if us will get justice is to become a Thorne in their peverbiale backsides where they will eventually act just to make you finally go away.
go through the list above and contact them all. Do one letter and cc it to all and sudry if you think of any we haven't thought of please enlighten us
best of luck remember you are no longer alone
Bel
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My MP wrote to the area commander of Kent police on August the 4th, and has not yet had a response nearly 2 months down the line !
I sent him a reminder letter yesterday...........just imagine if plod wanted something from me and I kept them waiting that long !
The guy who has my car was trying to sell it when the police approached him......and now they have given him a further 8 weeks to dispose of it.
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My MP responded today.....he has sent my letter on to the Area Commander of Kent police , which is good. I said that The One Show had approached me with a view to doing an article.......wonder if that'll kick start plod?
Have you heard any more from The One Show baron? I dropped a reminder email to Anna yesterday.
Edited by Titan500 on 05/10/2011 at 21:42
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I am another innocent person who has had their car stolen which in itself is quite distressing, however the police then contacted me to advise they have found my car in Kent. At first I was quite excited and found the new promising however the car was stolen mid August whilst I was away on holiday and here I am towards the end of October no further forward. The police say that the they will not seize the car as this is now a civil case and I need to go via the interpleader system. My insurance company haven't paid out on the theft yet so apparantely they have their hands tied and cannot get involved - the police have even lodged a complaint against them for trying to tell them how to do their job! I am just incredibly frustrated and want my car back but have no idea - without substantial costs and fight to me - how I can achieve this. This is just so wrong. I paid £8,000 for this car which was a substantial amount of money to me and i have the V5 document along with all other relevant paper work to prove that the car is mine. What is wrong with the legal system?! I have contacted a solicitor who advised that she will write to the police with a strong letter reminding them of their obligations but judging by other reports on the forum of honest john this may not be a solution. I feel really strongly about this - I could probably get the insurance company to pay out for the car but they won't pay what the car is worth so I will be out of pocket plus I will then lose my no claims and my insurance on any replacement car will be more money. Why should he get to drive around in my car - whether he bought it innocently or not why should I be the one who comes out of this out of pocket?! It is just wrong. Please help!!!
Thanks,
frustrated pic from Oldham
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Hi all,
I've had no further news on this, I will give my contacts a chase. I have found a solictor who may be willing to take my case on-just need to pay him a visit to see what can be done.
G
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Hi all,
I've had no further news on this, I will give my contacts a chase. I have found a solictor who may be willing to take my case on-just need to pay him a visit to see what can be done.
G
Hi Baron....thanks for the update.
I have written several emails to Anna from the 1 show now, without reply...which I find disappointing. Presumably you've heard nothing either?
Paul
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Hello pic.....welcome along. You are in good company here.....we all know how you feel, and we share your frustration. I guess you have read through the thread, so you will have an idea where we are with this issue.
In my own case, the car was not covered by insurance, but in yours....surely the insurance company are obligated to pay you, and once they do, the car will become theirs. I would be very interested to know what action they will then take to recover their asset. I really can't believe they will sit back and accept that it's a civil matter and do nothing. Can you not contact the insurance company and find out what they will do? Maybe even thrash out a deal with them? They are not in the business of losing money, and can be most tenacious when it comes to ensuring they don't.
You can see on here the routes people have taken, please let us know what action you take and keep us up to date with your progress.
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Well there's a thing !
It's sunday November 6th, and I'm watching a program on Sky channel 109 (watch) called, Cars, cops and criminals. It started at 11pm, and the first atricle is about stolen caravans. A team of police officers have gone to a steam rally in order to perform routine checks on the many caravans at the rally. They have checked the identities of a number of the caravans, and discovered several that are reported stolen. The people in posession of the stolen caravans, have given accounts of how they purchased their caravans, but are told by the officers that the caravans do not belong to them, and the caravans are towed away there and then for return to the rightful owners. One man who questions the action, is told that the caravan will be returned to the legal owner, and his contract is with the person he paid for the caravan, and he will have to persue them. All of the people who have bought stolen caravans, have them cofiscated, as, according to the police they will be returned to the legal owners, or the insurance companies who have paid out on them.
This is exactly what should be happening with our cars. The theft of a car is a criminal act. Period. When a stolen car is found, it should be returned to the legal owner, which may be an individual, or an insurance company. Yes it's tough on the person that loses the car, but it simply isn't his....that's the law. He doesn't have good title. He will have to persue his losses from the person he bought it from, and so on along the line. Someone will be out of pocket for sure.....but why would it be the innocent legal owner of the car?
Can anyone explain why the police are recovering the caravans in the program I've just watched, but they refuse to get involved in our stolen cars? What's the difference?
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hi , i am in a similar predicament , my car was stolen , although in my case the logbook and keys were taken as well, i reported it to the police , was contacted yesterday by the police (3 months later) to say they had stopped my car and the people that bought it had bought it in good faith , so its now a civil matter , i know where the car is and will be taking it back tonight regardless of the consequences , surely if someone steals my car and its a civil matter then when i steal it back it should also be a civil matter , i will post up on here once ive taken it back and let you know how i get on , if all goes well then maybe we should set up a car snatch back squad and go as a group to each location our cars are at , im not pepared to let this alone , that was my property and i want it back , i really hope some of you have more luck in getting your cars back , i will be setting up an online petition maybe if we get enough people to sign it then someone might take some notice and realise that there MUST be a change in the law
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Hi ads.....I like your style. Let us know how the recovery operation goes. Did you check out the program I referred to a couple of posts back? I fail to see why the police were taking the stolen caravans away from innocent purchasers, but refuse to do the same with any of our cars......stolen caravans are a crime but stolen cars aren't?
When I failed to get a satisfactory response from the police myself, I contacted my local MP, who wrote to the Area Commander on my behalf....that was on August the 4th. The only response we have had in almost 4 months, is to be asked for copies of letters and documents which they had already been given.
If there are any lawyers reading this by chance, where can we read what the law actually says about stolen goods, and their recovery? We all know that you can never inherit better title to goods than the person has that sells you them, and therefore a car which is stolen, technically never belongs to anyone other than the original owner, regardless of how many times it changes hands or how innocent the keeper claims to be.
What progress, if any, is anyone else making? I got quite excited when the One show contacted me in response to BaronGroogs efforts.......they even asked if I would be willing to go infront of the camera in a program to hilight our plight. Then, suddenly, all contact ceased despite several emails from me. I even wrote direct to the show, instead of direct to the reporter I had been corresponding with, to see if she had left , or dropped the idea, but didn't even get a response to that email? What's going on?
Do we need to write direct to Cameron, and cut out all the others, or what about the papers? Keep the iedeas coming please, we can't let this drop.....it's wrong !
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Soooo........ i went and took my car back , quite forcibly i must admit , parked it outside my house , took the useless police 25 minutes to come and arrest me , so i was charged with theft of a motor vehicle , to which i argued ,. noooo its a civil matter , anyhow as the story goes , they returned the car to the people who shouldnt really have it , and bailed me , soon as i was bailed i went straight back round there and took it again , this time when they arrested me i told them i bought it in good faith and surely its a civil matter , the answer to that is ... No , so anyhow , just spent a night in the cells for commiting an offence while on bail so i thought id come and post an update before i go again and take it for a third time , i have a feeling that this time i will not get bail but to be quite honest i dont really give a toss , just rang the sun, mirror , news of the world and the metro , told them my story and whats going on, so when i get my phone call it will now be to my mate who is going to ring all those papers up and have plenty of press in court , so we will see what the judge has to say when i tell him the second they let me out i will be going back round there to take MY PROPERTY back .
not a lot else to say at the minute , i will try and keep you all posted on the outcome , the only way to get a change in the law is to make a stand , some of you may think that what im doing is wrong but i have a feeling that most of you will agree that something needs to be done , dont forget to get all your friends to sign the petition , because as i said regardless of the consequences i will continue to take my vehicle back until somebody takes notice
im sure the papers will have something to say about it when i become the most prolific car theif of the year , gonna be the only person to take the same car over and over again lol ,
anyhow peace out people will post up when i can , im off to get my car back AGAIN
Edited by Avant on 29/11/2011 at 22:41
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As Titan 500 says above, the law as it stands gives you good title to the car, as the thief couldn't pass title to the subsequent 'purchaser' that he didn't have.
Is the problem here that without the V5 (log book) you can't prove to the police that the car is yours?
Good luck!
Edited by Avant on 29/11/2011 at 22:45
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Avant....obviously I can't speak for Ads, but I doubt it has anything to do with the V5. My car was stolen, and I still have the V5. I also have the keys and the roof ! It is a convertible with a detachable roof you see.....
AND the police still won't recover it for me !
I had owned the car for 6 years or so and no longer had a receipt, but I offered to obtain proof of purchase, and the investigating officer said it wasn't necessary.....so he obviously believed me.
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I agree - if you were able to find your car you would surely be within your rights to drive it away and reclaim it..
As Belinda says toward the top of this thread: "I spoke to a criminal lawyer friend who told me I was well in my rights to just go and seize the car back."
What I can't understand is why the police are arresting Ads for doing just that - unless they for some reason doubt his title to the car.
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What would be handy, is the reference from the appropriate act that confirms you are within your rights to sieze the car back. Can you get that information? The last email I sent to Belinda, she didn't reply......
Edited by Titan500 on 01/12/2011 at 21:16
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I am currently going through this.. my car was stolen from me by deception on Friday then sold on Saturday and the new owner now believes he is the owner of the car, I have the log book so he cannot register it and the car is still tagged as Stolen.
On Tuesday evening, My advert was still on Autotrader. The guy and his brother had just bought the car in suspicious cirmcumstances and wanted to check out the value online as they had paid around 50% of the real value. so when he saw me advertising the car, rang to ask me some questions. It was obvious quickly that the number plates matched and the car they had was the car that was stolen. I told them to contact the police so they could return the car to me.. the guy who called me was the brother of the guy who had the car and was very reasonable. Sadly the brother who had the car was not. He called me soon after to say he bought the car in what he believed was legitimate circumstances so its his car and if i wanted it back I would have to buy it from him! and if i didnt he would break the car into many pieces and sell it to recoupe some of the money. i then called the police to tell them what had happened and I knew who had the car and could they get it back as this guy was threatening to break it up and would deny ever having it.. the police did nothing as no one was yet assigned to my case.. (formal statemenrt was made on Tuesday)
anyway..Wednesday morning, i called again to find out if someone could help me.. i was told id have to wait until maybe 3 or 4pm when someone may be assigned to my case.. so in this time, id found my stolen vehicle, been blackmailed and the police would not do anything. Anyway I was assigned a police officer around 10am after kicking up a stink.. the police officer came to see me to recover some CCTV of the guy who stole my car so I asked when I get my car back.. he said id have to take the new "owner" to civil court to get my car back, or come to a personal agreement with him where I buy my car back! I was also given the line "possesion is 9, 10ths of the law" - I also have the nd key to the car and if I go and get my car back i coul dbe arrested.. for theft of my own car..
Anyway the guy who now has the car rang me, tried to be reasonable but said he was still not returning my car as he felt it was now his car. he said he would go and talk to the police with the paperwork he was given when sold the car and see where he stood.. he said he would call me when he came out the station.. since then Ive heard nothing. so i have no idea if he went to the station at all..
I have since contacted some people to get some publicity. I now have a relative who was a police officer and is working on this with the duty inspector. The current information is that I should not pay the guy any money , he should have taken the car to the police station but still "may" have a claim to the car!.
The guy who stole my car has now been arresated on MANY other offences and my theft is not an issue and may just go on file. They may not even prosecute for it as they have mountains of other evidence that will put him away for a while.. - i explained this isnt my concern, my concern is my car and I thought that it was the duty of the police to return my stolen vehicle.. apparently not! SO basically you can buy a stolen car and keep it.. so where it says buyer beware on the front of a V5 it means nothing..
to be continued..
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This is so crazy......the police have lost the plot. I think they are not interested in pursuing any case where a prosecution may prove slightly difficult, and they use the "civil matter" line as a get out. It's utter horse crap, does this attitude apply to all stolen goods now, or are cars a special case. The law is now positively condoning/encouraging car theft, as they refuse to return the stolen vehicles to their owners. How can a stolen car ever be civil?
I received a letter from my MP yesterday, ....the police have finally responded to him, after 4 months ! They seem to be suggesting that they are not recovering my car because they had no record of my original letter reporting the theft, and that the V5 was never in my name. b***** ironic really, because they have since lost/mislaid all of the documents I sent them, (so is it a surprise they have no record of my original report)...and a V5 clearly states it's not proof of ownership. I offered to obtain proof that the car was mine 8 months ago, and they told me it was not necessary, after all, I still have the original keys and the original V5, and the car's detachable roof....looks like I shall have to do it anyway !
Where do we write next? My MP carried zero clout, so the next letter I write to the feds will definitely give them the miseries. Or perhaps we should stop sodding about and write to the PM? What about the major rags? Anyone got any suggestions?
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What I find incomprehensible is not so much the police's reluctance to be involved (lack of evidence to catch the thief, usually) as the threats that they would arrest you for recovering your own car when you have proof of ownership.
Anyone know what the justification could be?
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It's all gone quiet folks, what's happening? Have you all run out of puff? That's what happens in these struggles against authority, they stonewall you, give you the run around and hope you just run out of steam......it stinks when you feel you have a just arguement, and nobody will listen. The ONE show thing was wierd....the reporter emailed me several times and was double enthused, even asked me if I would be happy to state my case in front of the camera.....to which I of course agreed. Then suddenly, as if a switch had been thrown, nothing ! She stopped responding to my emails....I wrote several, and I even wrote direct to the show to ask what had happened several times....but not a single reply. Is it possible they were told to leave this contraversial issue alone? After all. I would presume that what applies to cars, also applies to other stolen property, surely cars are not some sort of special case.....and the action, or lack of, by the police, effectively condones the theft of these cars. If the general public got to hear of this it would doubtlessly be damaging for people's opinion of the law.
Did any of you see the documentary showing the police confiscating caravans from people at a steam rally? I didn't once hear an officer say, " it appears stolen, but it's a civil matter". No sir....they took the caravans right away, there and then.
BARON....did the ONE show drop you too?
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It's all gone quiet folks, what's happening? Have you all run out of puff? That's what happens in these struggles against authority, they stonewall you, give you the run around and hope you just run out of steam......it stinks when you feel you have a just arguement, and nobody will listen. The ONE show thing was wierd....the reporter emailed me several times and was double enthused, even asked me if I would be happy to state my case in front of the camera.....to which I of course agreed. Then suddenly, as if a switch had been thrown, nothing ! She stopped responding to my emails....I wrote several, and I even wrote direct to the show to ask what had happened several times....but not a single reply. Is it possible they were told to leave this contraversial issue alone? After all. I would presume that what applies to cars, also applies to other stolen property, surely cars are not some sort of special case.....and the action, or lack of, by the police, effectively condones the theft of these cars. If the general public got to hear of this it would doubtlessly be damaging for people's opinion of the law.
Did any of you see the documentary showing the police confiscating caravans from people at a steam rally? I didn't once hear an officer say, " it appears stolen, but it's a civil matter". No sir....they took the caravans right away, there and then.
BARON....did the ONE show drop you too?
Hi, yes the one show dropped me, inexplicably just went quiet as did some other media I was talking to.
Haven't made any more progress, was speaking to a solicitor about it but he's gone cold too.
At a loss as to what to do, no one cares and I can't see myself making progress.
However, I haven't given up-I will persue the matter-just have been busy with my new daughter!
Any more news from anyone else?
How did the guy who stole his car back get on?
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This thread is terrific news-it means that I can legally go stealing motors and selling them on, and the plod won't do anything about it, can anybody tell me when this change in the law took place?
Except that where I live-In France-you won't get away with this sort of blag. The plod over here aren't little five foot six inch weasels with glasses, they are usually six foot plus with an attitude problem and built like brick outhouses and they don't like thieves. If you dish them them out a load of mouth over here you will find yourself bumping into doors and falling over and hurting yourself no end and probably spending the night in a French prison cell-not a pleasant experience I have it on good authority.
Over here, the registered owner on the french V5 is the legal owner and you have to carry the V5 with you at all times to prove that you are the owner of the car that you are driving-if you can't, or you can't prove that you are driving with the owner's permission you get a trip to the cells while they sort it out.
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phew !
I thought I was on my own there for a while lads. Very very glad to see I'm not. In my own case, the police have been positively obstructive. When I sent copies of all the letters and documents to the county police HQ with my letter of complaint, I marked the envelope very clearly, "please forward to the correct dept/officer if incorrectly addressed2. The reply I received did NOT include my bundle of copies, and simply said, that my letter of complaint should be addressed to some particular officer.....and where is this officer? Correct, at police HQ.....the very same building and postcode I had written to. Do they not have internal mail, or someone capable of walking to another room to put my letter in someone's in box? It's just blatant b***** minded obstructiveness.......thing is now, I'm not sure if I want to write again to the "correct" officer, because I just know nothing will happen, and I will waste my energy battling with them. We need to know what the law says.......plod is only there to operate the law, not make it. Surely somewhere there is a paragraph in an act that says stolen goods that are located must be returned to the rightful owner?
What about the papers? Anyone think there is any mileage in going to them?
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Oh...and I meant to ask, has anybody checked out the documentary that I referred to in my posts of Novenber 6/7th ? Please take a look....get to see it if there is any way possible. It just totally contradicts everything that this thread is about, and I would like to know how the police can justify this variety of approaches to what is essentially the same crime.
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Hi, not watched the doc, but read the piece you linked to. Yes, it's the same crime and yes, we're getting screwed over.
There are dozens of Police programmes showing situations like ours on a weekly basis and I, nor anyone else I have spoken to, can fathom how the Police are able to avoid doing anything. The excuses they are giving are pure billshut and frankly make me question the morality of all of the forces involved. Our legal system has become a joke and the Police are the clowns-never funny and always a bit sad looking!
I really don't know what to do, no lawyer will touch my case, media has lost all interest and the DVLA won't even give me the guy's address so I can take him to civil court! The "crim" is protected and the victim left high and dry.
I' going to give it one last go with the press-maybe Murdoch's group would like to be seen sticking it to the Old Bill and getting some trust back?!
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I was contemplating/have been contemplating that approach for a long time now. My next move should be, to copy all the docs to date, and send them to the bod at police HQ that the legal dept there suggested . The trouble with that, is that you just know they will push me from pillar to post, and ultimately do **** all.
It's good to hear from you Baron, please keep me posted on your actions/intentions, and I will follow suit. This scandal needs to be brought to the public's notice.
email... pacluc46@aol.com
Paul.
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I was pleasantly surprised to receive a letter from my MP, Sir Roger Gale, yesterday, asking if I had obtained a satisfactory result to my problem.....and could he be of further assistance. I have replied telling him that the return of my stolen car is the only possible satisfactory outcome. I also told him that I would not be pursuing the issue through the police, as I already know that they are going to waste my time and push me from pillar to post until I lose the will to live, and just give up.
I'm not sure which would tactically be the best paper to write to, but yesterday I wrote a brief summary of my situation and sent it to the Sun on sunday....I will of course, keep you posted as to the reult.
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Hi to anyone still following this thread.
It would be good to hear from any previous posters, what progress has been made, or what avenues of action have been taken.
Personally, I have involved my MP. who thankfully has been supportive, and active. He appears to agree with me on the points I have raised, and I think it would be beneficial for all of us if everyone here were to write to him stating their case. The fact that the police are turning their backs on the innocent victims of motor theft needs to be bought to light.
He can be contacted on galerj@parliament.uk in fact I may also email him myself with a link to this thread.
Paul.
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The "Money" sections of newspapers like the Telegraph seem to have the ear of financial institutions. This is definitely a financial hit, due to misconduct in office, I'd say. Jessica has the following banner to her page "Jessica Investigates":
Many readers complain that the financial institutions that are keen to take their money are less willing to answer legitimate questions. Sometimes the power of the press, in the shape of Jessica Gorst-Williams, can help.
Substitute police for financial. We pay them. They tend to forget that.
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Apologies....I should have said, my email to the Sunday sun, went unanswered.
I have decided to send a link to this thread to my MP.
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