I went to vote. Both ballot papers had unique serial numbers, and those numbers were logged against my number on the electoral roll. Seems my vote is no longer a secret. >>
It has always been as described above as far as I know.
|
Indeed, jbif, has been like it for at least 25 years since I did a few elections poll clerking.
Actually, quite an interesting experience you should try it. Won't make you rich but you do get expenses, funnily enough the only times in my life anyone has ever paid me expenses, unlike the people who were being elected.......
|
>>Won't make you rich but you do get expenses>>
A friend of mine, now sadly no longer with us, used to work as a clerk at a polling booth when elections came round.
It meant a 20 mile trip each way and a very early and late finish, but he got well rewarded payment wise, plus expenses.
Edited by Stuartli on 04/06/2009 at 19:22
|
|
|
|
Your vote has not been secret for decades. They have always written your voting number on the stub of the voting slip.
More info about security issues here:
tinyurl.com/pgst55
|
Oh no, don't tell HJ or Mr X !! :)
1) They probably already know
2) Please don't troll
Smokie, Moderator
Edited by smokie on 04/06/2009 at 13:51
|
|
so they would never get left on a train then?
|
"so they would never get left on a train then? "
No. they'd leave them in a lay-by, I think, or perhaps chuck them in back of the the dustcart, which then drives down the road with them fluttering out in the slipstream.
Agreed, you need the tally sheet and the ballot paper to connect me to my votes, but it's not that hard, really, Who'd have thought the Telegraph would have access to MPs' expenses records?
|
|
"Telegraph would have access to MPs' expenses records" - serious money changed hands I understand.
|
"Telegraph would have access to MPs' expenses records" - serious money changed hands I understand.
Govt cannot do much about the Telegraph
1) The Govt paid a bank insider for info in Lichtenstein about offshore money from UK People
(double standards!)
2) The Public would not support prosecuting the whistleblowers - a Knighthood is more likely
|
Apparently the information acquired by the Telegraph (scoop story of the century so far) was contained on just one CD or DVD disk.
The paper had a team of 25 working on the information to collate all the stories which have since been broken.
Seems there's still enough sleaze available to keep the paper's coverage going for quite some time yet.
>>serious money changed hands I understand>>
But still less, for instance, than some celebrities are given for book serial rights.
|
Seems there's still enough sleaze available to keep the paper's coverage going for quite some time yet.
And phenomenally boring it is to a news addict, nothing but tinpot shopping lists. What, I can't help wondering, is the purpose of making the mother of parliaments look a complete venal idiot in front of foreigners who won't really understand, most of them having parliaments just as bad or worse, apart from distracting the populace from the bank meltdown which does have a serious side? Hardly worth buying the paper these days except for Matt and the Garland political cartoons (today's is a lulu).
The election here is Euro, not Local. I wasn't going to bother, but my sister-in-law is under the weather and wants to vote, so I have agreed to drive her to the polling booth at a nearby school. Like my wife she thinks people ought to vote or the whole democratic system could become an empty shell as it is in some third world countries.
I can only agree. And I will probably vote Labour out of sheer intellectual idleness. Just wish Screaming Lord Sutch was still around, campaigning in his hearse.
|
Ive voted ,always do ,even if where i live it will do no good.
Its the taking part and being able to hold your head up and say i didnt vote them in.
I really wish we had a system where to vote was the law and a refusal gave you a thrashing ;-)
|
Its the taking part and being able to hold your head up and say i didnt vote them in.
By NOT voting I guarantee I can say I didnt vote them in.....
|
|
Agreed you need the tally sheet and the ballot paper to connect me to my votes but it's not that hard really
wouldnt take forever to scan into a computer, then load to a database....
|
We've just been up to vote...interesting security on the ballot boxes, i'll bet the fraudsters will really struggle to find similar non serial numbered plastic cable ties as fitted.
No wonder we get the individuals we do..;)
|
|
|
|
Vote - lot of people have sacrificed much for you to do.
|
Vote - lot of people have sacrificed much for you to do.
They also sacrificed much to give freedom of choice.
my choice? not to vote.
IMO it doesnt make much odds who you vote for.
the people who REALLY make the decisions (advisors and civil servants) rarely change.
Politics? never a safe subject to discuss in public. Thats my last word on the subject.
|
>>the people who REALLY make the decisions (advisors and civil servants) rarely change.<<
Sir Humphrey? Is that you?
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
I don't like the idea of voting for a party rather than an individual and my brain started to turn to jelly when someone started to explain it. Disinterest I think. If it needs to be explained then it can't be right. The guy in front of me wasn't happy about having one vote for 8 seats but I think he was out of order giving the voting clerk (right expression?) a hard time. I guess the system was devised in Brussels and certainly not by the guy handing out the voting forms. So, I've done my bit. I bet a politician gets in :-(
JH
|
|
I have voted, because I feel I should. However, I would have much preferred to have been given the option of 'None of the above', so that I could indicate an abstention, as it were.
|
... I would have much preferred to have been given the option of 'None of the above', so that I could indicate an abstention, as it were....
They wouldn't dare, because particularly in a Euro election, 'none of the above' would win by a landslide.
The gravy train would then hit the buffers and no politician would want that.
Euro MEP expenses dwarf those claimed by MPs - even the dishonest ones.
|
|
The European Parliament ballot form was so big that when it was folded it was reluctant to go through the slot into the ballot box. I had to pick uo the clerk's pencil to help to push the form into the box!
|
>>At the Count, the marked ballot papers are kept face upwards so that no-one may attempt to see the number on the back of the ballot paper.<<
From the security link above.
>>when it was folded it was reluctant to go through the slot into the ballot box. <<
From L'escargot.
If you have to fold it then the number is visible, therefore anyone may attempt to see it.
I noticed the same thing, L'escargot. I did think of complaining to the clerk about it but the polling station was in the skittle alley area of the local pub and the bar was open----
I also read on an official notice that it is a criminal offence to deface a ballot paper. If "they" wish to prosecute then there must be tracability?
|
We only had Euro polling yesterday. When we went to vote, the polling clerk folded the giant form for both of us in advance (to a quarter of the original size) so it would fit through the slot in the quite small canvas type voting box.
|
When we went to vote the polling clerk folded the giant form for both of us in advance (to a quarter of the original size) so it would fit through the slot in the quite small canvas type voting box.
Interesting comments in earlier posts.
I spent yesterday from 0630 til 2230 working at a polling station so I can speak with a just a little authority.
Please believe me, if you have not been involved behind the scenes, the red tape, processes belt and three braces processes has to be seen to be believed.
The forms that have to be completed, EVERY thing logged and accounted for, the envelopes that have to be labelled and filled is astounding.
I have absolutely no concerns whatsoever in the processes.
All polling forms are numbered. I logged the voter number for each form I issued.
I personally queried what happened to these forms.
The forms I completed are placed in specific logged envelopes and sealed.
These envelopes can only be opened on the authority of (legal) judge in the event of a disputed very close result.
All material from the polling station has to be accounted for, bagged up, closed up and logged.
I was surprised the even the backing cardboard from the pads was collected, logged and bagged.
Re giant forms.
We handed them out totally unfolded or even bent ( in the true sense).
Quite early in the morning we had a firm directive NOT to fold or even bend the forms as UKIP had protested so we were doing things correctly.
In my PERSONAL opinion not enough thought had gone into supplying appropriate / enough ballot boxes for the EU forms at my polling station.
We did have an official embossed long flat "paddle" to push the posted papers further down into the box.
I have previously worked on the count so have also experienced the next part of the process.
This too is belt and three braces approach so I am also at ease with this side of things.
If you have ever seen the TV coverage of any count you will see lots people there.
I was inside the square workingon the count and all those out side were there but not working on the count.
These others are members of the public with a wide variety of interests.
Candidates, TV, press, agents MPs, et al.
I was closely observed by members of the public who are free to comment at any time.
e.g. "you are putting that vote on the wrong pile mate !"
I hope this clarifies things
Remember ANYONE can go to the count and observe things.
|
I was chatting to a neighbour earlier who also carried out a similar task yesterday.
She had already been on a half day course.
She spent a few hours on Wednesday evening checking everything that had been delivered to her house ready for yesterday.
Up at 5am on Thursday to get to the station for 6am to give herself an hour to sort everything.
At the station until 10pm for 144 voters to pass through the station. She was kept busier redirecting those who came to the wrong one due to changes this year!
She then had to bag everything up as instructed and this was then checked twice when delivering the ballot box and paperwork.
She arrived home just before midnight.
Her pay for this was far less than the minimum wage!
|
Two of us on the issuing desk logged over 700 during the day. nearly 100 in one hour
Most but not all entitled to two voting forms.
Plus many queries, e.g carers who assist wheelchair voters in the voting process have to fill in and sign a form. We only had very short breaks for calories /drinks.
We also had to ensure the completed form went in the appropriate box and YES there was a form to fill in for each dear member of the great public who put it in the wrong box.
A small request "Please take your voters form with you as it speeds the look up"
Many homes do not have numbers etc
|
|
|
The clerks at my polling station could not answer my questions about the logging of my ballot sheet serial numbers, and they could not tell me who I could call/write to to get them answered. I think that's avoidable in this day and age.
Edited by oldnotbold on 06/06/2009 at 11:32
|
oldnotbold,
Your local returning officer is the man - or woman - to answer your voting procedure queries.
Chances are he will be a senior officer, possibly the chief executive, of your local council.
He is highly paid by the public to serve the public and should be prepared to take your call and/or answer your email.
Ring the council on Monday and I'm sure they will give you a name, if not put you through.
|
|
Thanks, but I'm clear now that the procedure is robust and reasonable. It's just a pity that the clerks at the poll were not briefed to answer my perfectly reasonable question, or direct me to the answer.
|
Agreed, v poor performance by the clerks.
If they didn't know, they should at the very least have been able to direct you to a man who did.
|
Agreed v poor performance by the clerks.>> If they didn't know they should at the very least have been able to direct you to a man who did.
I tend to agree with that comment.
Any question I could not answer I called over my boss or directed the person enquiring to him so we could press on.
If my boss did not know or needed to check details at the central office then it was straight on the phone and an answer was obtained immediately.
e.g. question. "My daughter is on the list but not my son so why not?."
A call to the central office and they replied " When the voter registration form was completed you ommitted your son. Would you like to complete a form now so he can vote next time?"
I was very impressed at the immediate answers to any questions raised.
On Sunday evening, for a few hours I will be counting the scrolls or lost under a paper mountain.
Reading my instructions I am not convinced the standard instructions for the normal ballot papers will work for the scrolls. We will see!.
I second calling the local council and they will put you in touch with the correct person to answer your questions. I have always found ours very helpful.
My letter of appointment is signed by The Local Returing Officer who is the Chief Executive of our Borough based at our Civic Centre.
|
Henry k.
What happened to the European election count? Has it been held over, or has the count been done and the authorities are keeping schtum until the rest of Europe declares?
Do you know the result? Can you be bribed? Would you like a ride - or a drive even, in my new convertible?
|
|
I think the results are being announced tomorrow.
|
Sky News has a programme devoted to the results on Sunday evening from 8pm. No doubt BBC News (24) will be doing something similar.
|
What happened to the European election count? Has it been held over or has the count been done and the authorities are keeping schtum until the rest of Europe declares?
>>
It has not yet happened in Elmbridge. I start my counting stint from 17:30 til at least 21:15 at the Xcel Leisure Centre Walton.Do you know the result? Can you be bribed? Would you like a ride - or a drive even in my new convertible?
>>
I like your offer but even when I have finished at Walton I probably will not know the result. We may have finished our bit and everyone is happy that the outcome is accurate BUT the grand total appears to be assembled by The Regional Returning Officer in Southampton. ( The South East region?)
I am assuming that he has to await all the Local Returning Officers totals before he uses his abbacus to finalise the grand finale.
So I am honestly not bribable this time as " I no nothin !"
|
The UK count has been delayed so that all counts across Europe start at the same time on Sunday evening.
Sunderland, which has established a name for being one of the first to declare on General Election nights, is once again looking to do a quick count.
This time, of course, it's the North East Euro constituency, but the count is being held in Sunderland's thoroughly un-lovely 1960s civic centre.
|
|
|
|
|
