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A neighbour has just bought a Mazda5 2.0-litre MZR-CD (143ps). I haven't mentioned the problems with the 6 yet but do they share the same engines and HP pumps?
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Just browsing the Mazda website and the new 6 diesel engine is described as 2.0 M-TDi (140ps) - a new engine replacing the old 6?
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Galad
The 5 is indeed the same - I think that there's a case in Vol 1.
Haven't seen this new engine yet; but it certainly looks like the MZR has been quietly dropped....
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danyosan Idling-related issues are often the first sign of the HP pump going. As Mazda are saying it's suction valves failing; that would fit with the symptom as the suction side of the pump probably works best with a few revs on.
Would you recommend some measures to be taken now then. It is going for new brake discs shortly so I could get things done then.
Also, will I be OK holding onto it or should I get rid ASAP
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Nothing is certain in this life; but I wouldn't be surprised if it's going to need a costly pump overhaul in the next 10,000 miles.
If you were thinking of changing it anyway; this would seem a good time.
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Well thats the problem. I was hoping it would last me another 2 years as I am in the process of building a house. I might look into selling it privately and buying another for a similar price. Any recommendations? I average around 450 miles a week.
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Trade it in to a Mazda dealer for a petrol one. That'll stitch them up nicely.
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Petrol is not really a goer I'm afraid, I do too much mileage.
I've been recommended to go for a peugeot diesel (poss a 307), would this be a good option?
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Ehh? Petrol has been cheaper overall for years - it must be a no-brainer with the current price spread?
Touch a French car at your peril.
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Check car by car breakdown for the 307 above, french build quality has gone down the toilet lately.
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Hi Screwloose
Thanks for all your info about Mazda 6 diesel problems! I have a 53 plate one with 47000miles on the clock. It hasn't cost me anything so far apart from servicing and tyres but looks as though I should change it whilst I am winning! Your advice is to get a petrol but having tried one I would miss the overtaking grunt of the diesel - I think people buy diesels these days for that rather than economy - how things have changed since my 205 GRD.
If I was to go for an 07 or 57 old model 6 do you think it will not suffer the pump or lubrication problems of the earlier cars?
I have a few thoughts on the lubrication problem. Most garages use a universal oil in both petrol and diesel cars for economy and so mechanics don't put the wrong oil in cars. One of the main differences with a true diesel oil is that it has more detergent to break down carbon deposits. I have used Morris XHD-FE 10W-40 oil in my diesel cars for many years and when I have had occasion to look inside the engines I have been staggered at how clean they are. (Renault 21 2.1TD new camshaft at 150,000miles and cracked sump on my Alfa 156 2.4JTD). I have supplied this oil to my Mazda dealer for servicing my 6 and they think I am mad but I wonder if that would prevent build up of carbon on the suction pipe even if some carbon was getting past the injector seals.
If I decide to keep my old car I thought the most sensible thing for me (and others) to do would be to fit a new suction valve in the HP pump before it packs up, runs dry and does other damage requiring a new or reconditioned pump. I have spoken to Feather Diesel and my Mazda dealer about that and it is way too sensible (and cheap?) for them to consider. If that can be done with the pump in situ (in super clean conditions) for about £150 it would save a lot of people mega money. If changing the suction valve does not affect the high pressure side of the pump I don't see the need for it to go on a test rig for the setting and calibration that Feather charge £200 for.
I wanted to talk to someone at Delphi/Denso about this approach but I am blowed if I can find any way to contact them in the UK. I have tried all the websites and search engines but only come up with general company info. Do you have a phone number, web site or email address?
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the engineer
Never tried changing the valves in-situ; but it sounds a very reasonable idea in theory.
I've not seen a very late one fail yet - mainly because the lease fleet that had most of them has stopped buying them....
I agree about the benefits of HD oils; long service intervals also can't help if there's combustion-derived carbon fragment build-up occuring - this is one engine that wants it's semi-synth draining overnight, from red hot, every 6000 max. Maybe they should bring back flushing oil?
Whether the oil detergents could, or should be expected to, cope with the effects of a combustion leak is a moot question. The quantities can be staggering; many Merc CDis have a small bucketful neatly cast under the engine shield. Getting at the injectors is nearly a Kango job!
Delphi are in Warwick:-
dieselaftermarket.delphi.com/asiapacific/Contact+U...m
I've also found County Diesel (Leicester) 01162 600096 useful for oddball diesel sub-parts in the past. They're quite helpful and do mail-order.
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I have also been looking at a 2006 2.0 TDCi (red eye) ford focus. Is it the same engine thats in this or would I be okay with this?
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Fortunately; Ford didn't use the MZR-CD in the Focus.
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Here's another sorry tale.
I bought a 52 reg Mazda 6 2.0d TS2 estate in June 07 with 42K on the clock from a Mazda dealer with service history all by them. It was a good car and really nice to drive with all the toys and leather seats. They said they gave it a full service before delivery and it came with 1 year Mazda warranty
I usually keep my cars a long time, 8 to 10 years, so I always have an extra oil change down every 5000 miles. I had this done and then the full service done at 50,000 to get it back on the normal service schedule. I had this done at my local independent garage that I've used for 20years and know he does it properly.
In May this year, 08, at just under 53k mileage, I was coming up to a roundabout when suddenly there was a loud metallic rattling. There were no warning lights on or any other indication of anything wrong. I had checked the oil about 1000 miles earlier and added about a litre. The Mazda rescue man came and said I shouldn't drive it so I'm relayed from Norwich back to London
After 4 weeks of expensive investigation and delay at a different Mazda dealership, £450, who said it looked like mechanical breakdown, and an inspection by an engineer sent by the warranty people I'm told I need a new engine as it suffered from lack of lubrication and number 4 cylinder is damaged and big end gone. Sound familiar? But the warranty refuse to pay anything! The say I broke the warranty contract by having the service done by a non-Mazda garage, I didn't check my oil and I drove it in a failed state.They say the EU BER legislation doesn't cover extended used warranties only new car warranties. Is this true? Anyway they seem to have won because there's no way I can prove that I topped the oil up or even checked it. They obviously know this is a common faullt and have this get-out.
I'm having a complete second-hand 07 engine put in at the moment by my local independent garage. This engine is a guaranteed 18000 miles.
I bought a Mazda because they were supposed to be reliable, worng. I bought it from a dealer to get the warranty: wrong and useless!. Is there anyway I can get some money out of the Mazda warranty? Should I get rid of this as soon as I can afford too?
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Trapperjem
The answer may lie in the oil. If the conjecture that this problem is caused by the oil pick-up blocking with carbon debris from leaking injector seals; then there may be some evidence available from oil analysis - particularly the contents of the filter.
It's a routine procedure for many fleets, only requires a few drops and is widely available; a chemical analysis that found such contamination would provide powerful evidence that the cause was not low oil.
As to the small-print of extended warranties - why do you think that they so seldom pay out....?
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Thanks for the info Screwloose,
I don't think I can do that check now as the car has been moved from the Mazda garage to my local with the engine top and bottom dismantled. I'll just have to pay out, I guess.
Would it be best to get rid of the car as soon as I can?
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You may find that the oil filter is still fitted; that's all you'd need.
As to getting rid - I would.
Edited by Screwloose on 15/06/2008 at 15:38
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Another one bites the dust!!!
2003 (03) Mazda 2.0 TS2. Regularly serviced by the same Mazda Dealership. Full oil service at 50K. Engine and turbo failed at 56K.
Oil light flickered on a roundabout. Checked Oil and level was normal. Light flickered again. Rang Mazda dealership who confirmed it was probably in need of a software upgrade or it could be the sensor in the sump and confirmed it was OK to drive over the weekend but book in for following week. Advice obviously all now denied!
Next morning, same roundabout loud squeal, loss of power, engine failure.
Mazda garage have quoted £9,350.73 to fit a new turbo and engine and Mazda UK are willing to pay 40% which means that having finished the finance payments last year we would now have to pay a further £5,610.43 to fix a car that afterwards will have a trade in value of £4,450. Alternatively it is only worth scrap value.
I guess Mazda expect us to take the loss and walk away which in my present state of mind I am not prepared to do.
We tried the insurance route as suggested by the garage. An engineer from our insurers inspected the vehicle and wrote: ?Engine has failed. Oil light came on, clutch juddering. Repairers have checked oil, level below minimum. Turbo has broken up, swarf present in oil. Engine is starting to seize due to oil starvation. New engine, clutch and turbo required. In my opinion this is mechanical failure and not our liability.?
A lawyer friend has now suggested getting an independent inspection report to detail exactly what caused the failure. We can then decide whether or not to move forward legally. Personally I do not understand the technicalities so would love for someone to tell me "this is meant to do this but failed and so this happened, this got hot, broke up and did this etc"
So my question is can anyone recommend a Mazda or Diesel Engine Specialist in the West Sussex/Hampshire area? I've started searching but wondered if there are people that specialise in this sort of diagnosis. Or am I best just using my AA membership and calling them in?
Sorry one more question. During the warranty period the turbo intercooler failed and was replaced by the same garage. I have no paperwork as none was given it was just done under warranty and returned. Anyone know if they are duty bound to provide that information if requested? Just wondering if the two could be related even though seperated by a couple of years?
Thanks for any replies and to those that have already posted.
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 30/06/2008 at 19:51
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Malcolm
That's the second case I've seen this afternoon. Isn't it amazing that Mazda hasn't heard of even one...?
The only catastrophic engineer that I know of in that area is Douglas Wragg. Contact details:-
www.sew.org.uk/database/automotive_experts.htm
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Hi all
Mazda 6 2.0D TS2 Estate (52 plate).
Its just recently started to idle very badly when first started, but runs fine when warms up a bit. Also sounds a bit clattery for the first few hundred yards!!
Oil level ok, never moves downward, no dash warning lights.
Having read all your comments I checked the EGR and it seams to be slightly open (as I can see clean part of the shaft) when the car is on idle.
Question : Should the EGR Valve be closed when idling and only open when revs are a bit higher?
I hope this is not the start of the HP pump issues.....
Thanks for any advice
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kilchum
The EGR system is a right pig's breakfast on these and could well be open at odd times - it will probably be open a little at idle.
Any idling fault is not a good sign; idle is where the pump valve fault first starts to show.
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Screwloose
Many thanks for your reply. I guess if Mazda actually admitted there was a problem with cars built at that time then they would face a huge liability. All the time they officially do not have a problem, they do not officially have to make it go away.
Have made contact with Douglas Wragg and will keep you informed as the matter progresses.
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Screwloose
Just spoken to Mr Douglas Wragg who sounds like a very nice, interesting, and knowledgeable chap. He would love to thank you in person for your recommendation.
He appears interested in taking up our case and is reviewing papers over the weekend.
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Malcolm
We've never met; but I've sent a few jobs his way and I've read and enjoyed many of the case-history papers he's had published in professional journals.
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Dear Screwloose,
Many thanks for your recommendation - I am flattered.
If you feel so inclined, please will you contact me offline so that we may have a discussion.
Kindest regards,
Douglas
dgwragg@btinternet.com
Edited by Dynamic Dave on 05/07/2008 at 21:05
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I have a 2003 2.0L Turbo Diesel Premacy, does this use the same diesel engine? As far as I know its not a common rail diesel.
The reason I ask is that for about 2 years (and 30,000 miles) I have had an intermittent warning light problem.
Basically the glow-plug light will come on while driving, and it will flash at a constant rate. I have taken the vehicle to my Mazda dealer whilst it was doing this and the 'code' (apparently it can be long and short pulses) indicated that the "accelerator voltage had gone outside its parameter range". Its a fly-by-wire accelerator pedal I was told. The dealer explained that this was a known problem with this engine and was due to 'soot' in the inlet manifold. They advised that I didn't need to do anything as long as the light was not on permanently. I must admit I wondered how soot could get into the inlet manifold.
Switching the ignition off and restarting the engine resets the light and then all is well untill the next time.
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thames6D
Fortunately; your engine isn't the common-rail version of the RF. It uses a rotary injection pump and should thus avoid all the afflictions of the MZR-CD.
Soot gets into the inlet from the EGR system.
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Screwloose,
Thanks for the info. I was worried for a while that my decision to go diesel for longevity was flawed.
Thames6D
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SL - quickie for you - my 02 MPV has now been sans-engine for.......4 months?........and I've just located a donor 19k miles engine from another one.
However, it's an 05 vs mine an 02 - is it compatible? What is the key thing to look for, to make sure it's right - the seller (trade) is adamant it is the same.
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galwaytt
I'm told that there are two distinct versions; but as to the exact detail differences and which occured in which year; that's tricky.
If the supplier is adamant that he has the correct engine; get it in writing as part of the contract that the engine he's suppying is fit for use in your [stated] vehicle. Make sure you pay by credit card only.
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has anyone got an email address for Mazda UK that I could write to? I see their website only offers phone or post.........
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Galwaytt
cim@mazdaeur.com
Mazda Motors UK Limited
Riverbridge House
Anchor Boulevard
Dartford
Kent DA2 6QH
Tel: 01322 622600
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My Mazda6 143bhp diesel is in for its first service today. On the bottom of the worksheet it said "intercooler 07".
When I asked why I was told that they had been told to check all intercoolers at service time. I asked for a little more details and the best I got was "some" are split so they all need checking. I'll post if mine needed replacing but thought people might be interested there is an intercooler problem too.
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Hi, this is my first post on what looks like a great forum.
I am looking at a Mazda MPV 02 registration (facelifted version) with engine number RF 767216. It seems that the engine oil has escaped via failed turbo seals and the engine has run low on oil causing knocking at the crank / big-ends. I'm told that the oil warning light did not light. I haven't taken the sump off yet.
Reading this thread, it seems this is a known problem so I'd really appreciate some help. First question, what was the first component to fail? Ie what's the root cause? I assumed it was the turbo but it seems there is a theory that the oil pick-up is getting blocked with carbon deposits from leaking injector seasl? How does that result in a blocked pick-up? Also, is the oil pump a known weakness?
Second question, this thread seems to be discussing the MZR engine ? is this the same basic design as the RF engine? Which cars could I look to in order to get a replacement engine or perhaps crank or con-rod?
Where can I read more on these engines / this problem?
Thanks for any help
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stick a decent Ford petrol engine in - sorted for life!
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Malcolm8484, and the rest of you guys who have had problems with your Mazda 6 diesels, ( just a suggestion ) why not band together and print out Vol 1 and Vol 2 of the Mazda 6 Turbo Diesel postings on this website and write directly to the TOP man in Japan,Mr Kazuhide Watanabe. If you address your envelope "Striclty Private and Confidnentional" then hopefully only he will open your letter/s. Perhaps include this website, so that he can view everybodies problems and maybe who knows it just might start something to help you guys out.
The address is as follows:
For the Attention of the MAZDA
Motor Co CHAIRMAN
Mazda Motor Co Ltd
Address: 3-1 Shinchi,
Fuchu-cho, Aki-gun,
Hiroshima-ken,
735-0028
JAPAN
I was going to buy a Mazda 6 diesel, but having read so many people having problems with them and some kindly advice from Screwloose, I decided not to. But then I also owned a VW GT TDI Golf that turned out to be a lemon as well. I now drive a petrol engine car.
Hope this helps :)
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Ok, I just bought a Mazda 6 TD, in a private buy, and on the way home (50 miles) I have had the engine warning light come on, plus the car seems to smoke a lot and use more diesel than I expected. The car was sold as seen.
After reading the above I am completely gutted.
I have booked it in with a Mazda dealer tomorrow, but I'm already feeling I've been sold a lemon.
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mbs
Could be an EGR system fault; it's now "normal" to sell-on cars with a fault - nobody seems to want to fix anything anymore.
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Ok, odd analysis from my local Mazda dealership, they have looked at the car and feel the engine warning light is due to a faulty neutral indicator switch (£100 to replace), and they want more time with the car to try to diagnose the smoke, but think the engine might just need a good clean out. They say the car is fine to drive in the mean time.
Not what I was expecting... the engine warning light caused by the car thinking the gearbox is in neutral.. and the excessive smoke is a coincidence? I'd be interested to see if the light goes out if they replace the switch.
Edited by mbs on 12/08/2008 at 21:22
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I've just had a look at the circuit diagram; there is a park/neutral switch shown, obviously for the auto, but I didn't think that it was on the manual too.
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Could they mean clutch position sensor I wonder, being a manual?
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Malcolm8484 and Raman - thanks for that info - I intend to write to both.......
FWIW, I got pricing on all the part to 'cure' (if such a thing exists...), my problem MPV. One item - crankshaft - I was quoted Eur 2300 for, excl VAT, btw..........add bearings and all the labour, etc..........and a new short block is cheaper: Eur 2800 for a short engine. I also new a new clutch and DMF as well........
Mentally, I've resigned myself to spending the money. But, two things niggle at this stage: now my engine never stopped - I did get the blinking oil light, and a precautionary sump drop spotted the #4 b/end issue, but it got me to thinking:
Turbo - this should have escaped the carnage.......
CR pump.......mmm, on two or 3 occasions, I did have the complete loss of power, nearly limp home mode...........should I budget for a Feather Diesel overhaul, as precaution, seeing as the entire engine is currently on on the garage floor....?
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galwaytt
You may have to take a chance on the turbo - good luck!
Loss-of power isn't the typical symptom of suction valves; that idle issues. However....
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