eMBe,
Not a maths teacher, but maths graduate and also had the benefit of state selective secondary school (do not remember questions like this to get in).
Advice I would offer is:
Relationship between 'S' and 'N' is key. Spot that N plus N plus S is N 'units' (may be tens are carried over, but hopefully this statement makes some sense). So for each value of N, there is a value of S. In this case:
S = 1, N = 9 (9 + 9 + 1 = 19, therefore, number will end in N)
S = 2, N = 8 (8 + 8 + 2 = 18)
S= 3, N = 7
S = 4, N = 6
S cannot be bigger than 4, or the equation pops.
I hope that is all that the examiners are looking for - from there I went to trial and error, and found:
139 + 129 + 81 = 349
258 + 268 + 72 = 598
317 + 327 + 53 = 697
SON + SUN + IS = OWN (Just checking)
At which point I stopped.
Answer to the question is U or O, (or maybe there is a solution with S=4, N=6) working is key, and I would suggest that it is the bit about spotting the relationship between S & N.
Hope someone can add a bit more to this, bit if you want more thoughts from me,post here and I can think again.
Jono
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eMBe,>> Not a maths teacher, but maths graduate >> Hope someone can add a bit more to this, bit if you want more thoughts from me,post here and I can think again.
Thanks Jono.
You have confimed my contention that the question has more than one answer.
I had tackled it by first saying that
S+S has to be < 10; hence 0 > S < 5.
Then I said
2N + S > 10, and found the various values for N given S between 1 and 4.
Also, since 2S = O ; O is even, and, O has to be = 2, 4, 6, or 8
Then in the middle column of the sum, using a carry forward of 1 from the sum of the third column,
1+I+O+U = W can be satisfied for a range of different input values of O.
My suspicion is that someone made upp a grid of numbers and posed the question without realising that that were more than one possible answers.
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>My suspicion is that someone made upp a grid of numbers and posed the question without realising that that were more than one possible answers.
Maybe, maybe not, but my guess is that it's the working out and the realisation that there is more than one answer they are after: any answer given, while it will have to be right, is probably secondary. I've been an examiner in the past (not maths, though) and I can tell you they are tricky blighters beyond your wildest dreams. This kind of test will separate the bright but lazy from the methodical and analytical: it's very rarely simply a matter of passing, but of doing it in the right way.
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Agree with ChrisR, in our neck of the woods the '11 plus' tests are really looking for the reasoned logic rather than a 'right' answer, hence the request to show all working.
Strangely, my son is at a Grammar school and recently sat his Maths GCSE, there was nothing anywhere near as tricky as this one in the GSCE paper!!
Cockle
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Agree with ChrisR, in our neck of the woods the '11 plus' tests are really looking for the reasoned logic rather than a 'right' answer, hence the request to show all working. Strangely, my son is at a Grammar school and recently sat his Maths GCSE, there was nothing anywhere near as tricky as this one in the GSCE paper!! Cockle
Thanks Cockle & Chris R. You are right, of course, - it is one way of separating the best wheat from the ordinary wheat and the chaff (there are 10 very clever applicants for every 1 place available!).
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Ermmm...is it:
s=1
o=2
n=9
u=0
i=4
w=7
?
SON SUN IS = OWN
129 109 41 = 279
since:
S S < 10 , that S < 5 , also S S <= O
N N S = N 10 implies that: N = 10 - S , N > 5,
also implies that: O add U add I = W - 1
Then I just went by gut hunch and tried some low numbers!
A bit slow took me about just over 10 mins!!!
HOW IS AN 11 YEAR OLD SUPPOSED TO DO THIS (especially in exam conditions!)
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Sorry Kennybase,
I tried editing your typo, but it seems that certain mathematical symbols have got lost in the edit. They are there when I edit, but dissapear when I update your post.
Can you post it again?
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No problem -
I think 'O < 7' is wrong! (should be ignored!!)
and it's 'O + U + I = W - 1' typo error!
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I have never left these shores (unless you count Anglesey!), but next year me, HF and the mini-HFs will be taking our holiday in foreign climes.
We don't really know where we want to go, but we have firm ideas about the type of holiday we want. I am all too aware that if we go to some of the high-street travel agents, we will be steered to the holiday that makes them the most comission and meets their needs best - to hell with us!
Are there any national travel agents who are completely independent and who will give us unbiased advice? Or are we best advised to go to a totally indepedent local agent? We are in the Bromley/Orpington area if anyone knows of any good ones.
Also, are all-inclusive holidays all they are cracked up to be?
Many thanks in anticipation.
Rob
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Rob, We haven't booked a holiday through a travel agent for years. We tend to look at brochures for ideas, or we ask friends and relatives where they went and if it was any good.
We then look up the area on the net and find local apartments, hotels etc. Flights are dead easy these days - and very cheap if you shop around. You can do a holiday like this for half what you would pay a travel agent and its a lot more satisfying.
The bonus is we have never had a bad holiday. I don't think I know anybody that doesn't have a story about a holiday that looked great in the brochure but was rubbish when they got there.
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"but we have firm ideas about the type of holiday"
Rob
Tell us what holiday you want, and maybe we can advise
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Fair point, RF.
Ideally we don't want a raucous beach resort. Somewhere slightly inland would be good. We'll be enjoying the company of a 13 year old and an 8 year old (both boys) so kids clubs are a pre-requisite. We don't really mind where we go - Spain, Italy, France, Germany, Holland, are all fine. We kind of want to keep it to Europe for now. Price-wise, I really have no idea. Never having been abroad, I have no idea what the current prices are. We don't want self-catering but as much flexibility as possible would be welcome.
Overly touristy areas are a no-go. I have quite enough of seeing young, alcohol-fuelled Brits on nights out when I'm working, ta very much!
Rome, Madrid, Venice etc all appeal.
That should give you something to go at!
Cheers
Rob
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Just to reinforce the other suggestions, the internet is your friend. I've never used a travel agent or been on a package tour so can't comment on these. On the other hand I've been to the continent several times in the past year just by booking flights and accommodation on line.
For flights try
www.ryanair.com
www.easyjet.co.uk
www.bmibaby.com
www.mytravellite.com
For accommodation, www.totalstay.com is a good bet.
Of course the complicating factor is that you're taking children. Perhaps for that reason, the normal tour operators should be considered, as locations aimed at families are more likely to be found through them. Also, I can't help suspecting that a package holiday would be the most economical way of doing it.
No doubt someone with experience of travelling with children will be able to provide the benefit of their experience.
Of the places I've been, Barcelona and Brussels (yes, really) have been the most interesting surprises. I think there'd be plenty in both to keep you all occupied. I've heard good things about Sardinia which is also on the budget airline (Ryanair) itinerary.
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Rob & HF:
I would not rule out travel beyond Europe. If you think you will not be going abroad often, try to widen your choice.
I can tell you that the best holiday that children in your age range (who have travelled extensively around the world) found in their experience were holidays in California and Florida. I have no idea of your budget, but if you time your holiday during Winter or Easter school holidays, the four of you could have 2 or 3 weeks break for around £2500. During these periods, this works out roughly as
Flights on Virgin or BA - about £1000 for the family.
All inclusive Car hire, with petrol at giveaway prices - about £300 for 2 weeks.
Accommodation booked as you go in Holiday Inn type places - about £50 per night for a family room. £700 for 2 weeks. You can do it much cheaper with coupons from exit-travel-guides available at most McD and Denny's fast food places.
Food - plentiful and cheap.
Entertainment - Disney in LA or Orlando are surprisingly good fun for adults too. This will be the most expensive part, but the children will love it.
California has the highest peak in USA and lowest point below sea level (Death Valley, Mojave desert). You can find snow and desert within 50 miles.
Side trip to Las Vegas from LA is worthwhile.
Kennedy space centre in Florida is a must.
Fantastic beaches, and lansdcape to visit in either state.
In either location, it is a joy to tour from place to place, booking your overnight stay at bargain rates as you arrive at a hotel/motel.
Shopping - HF should take lots of spending money for the bargains! ;-)
Ladies who are size 8 or 10 are said to find it easier, in USA than UK, to find clothes that fit. Unsurprisingly, it is also easy for people at the other end of the spectrum (size 20 plus) to find clothes to fit them!
Having said all this, Rob will say he can't afford it!
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Copy that. When my kid was a kid our best vacations were in the US. Great value for money, lots to do and great service. No language problem either. Much more bang for the buck than anywhere in W. Europe.
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Rob, lots of good tips here and the one that is really ringing bells is Florida. My wife and I went in the mid-90s, before we had kids, hired a Chrysler Sebring convertible, toured all around and also spent 7 days in and around Disney World. We are still talking about it. Just outside WDW, try Charlie's Steak House for THE best steak in the world (and I have eaten in 52 countries - cue where to find a better steak from Growler ;-).
If WDW interests you then you must get a book titled, The Unofficial Guide to Walt Disney World which has to be the most exhaustively researched guide to any single attraction ever. I am always lending it to friends who are planning to go. Look it up on amazon.co.uk.
Florida weather can be very hot and humid in the summer school holidays (if you are used to UK weather).
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eMBe, Growler and CMark (esp eMBe),
Many many thanks for your posts regarding the US. We will, no doubt, go there at some stage. But just now it is slightly out of our price range. Besides, the thought of HF getting all excited in a shop is just to scary to contemplate.
We do want to go abroad somewhere, but are stumped. There's a lot of world out there! Any recommendations?
Cheers
Rob
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Rob,
If you/HF/Kids are not used to travelling abroad, then the first time is the wrong time to try to get smart about it.
Book a cheap trip to a self-catering villa in somewhere like Lanzarote and enjoy it. If you really want, then book it with someone on the internet, although frankly I probably wouldn\'t bother.
Its true that there isn\'t that much to see of \"educational\" interest in the same way that there would be in Madrid, but its easy to live in and plenty to do.
There\'ll be enough people around speaking english and a sufficiently strong support infrastructure if you go with a package, that IMO its the best way for a first holiday.
If you get on well enough with that, the next time will be the time to choose flights, destinations further away, significantly different lifestyles or cultures, etc. etc.
If you hunt around the travel agents, don\'t be too picky about the destination, and you\'ll get a deal that will suit you and be cheaper. However, I would advise you to be picky about exactly where you stay. Sometimes they offer deals where they don\'t actually confirm the hotel and/or resort until you actually fly - I would not recommend that since you can get badly burned, albeit that you can be pleasantly surprised also.
Of course they\'ll try and push you towards a holiday that they want you to take; but if that holiday suits your choice, budget & requirements, then so what ?
I\'d also suggest that you consider whether or not two weeks for your first trip would be too much. You might hate it abroad - my sister does; a week or 10 days might be a safer bet.
You\'ve years to travel wherever you want, don\'t get put off by being too ambitious on the first one.
All IMO, of course.
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Rob,
Have you thought about France? You're faily close to the Channel Tunnel and a weeks trip to France may not be a bad idea.
It depends how your foreign driving is though. Get some recommendations about Hotels over there before you go.
Alternitively, do you know anyone with an RCI timeshare? Often they have a number of unbooked weeks and try to get shot of them to members for a booking fee, these can be passed onto a non member for a small additional fee. Albeit a few years ago the domestic goddes and I spent a week in Tenerife for £65 in a timeshare complex, thanks to my sister's membership and had a very nice time. The only problem is you do get pestered by timeshare salespeople over there.
We were given a choice between Tenerife, Lanzaroti or Portugal. Having since been to Portugal, this would have been my preferred choice - with hindsight.
Where ever you go - have a great time and SEND US A POSTCARD!
H
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Funnily enough I was thinking France wouldn't be a bad idea for a first trip for you as well. My brother, with two kids about the same age went a few years ago to South Brittany - not too far far to drive. He rented a big mobile home on a big site. Advantages? Relatively cheap, beach two minutes away and plenty of things for the kids to do on the site. We called to see them one evening as "we were just passing" Asked where his son was and he said he hadn't seen him for hours! Son then came back.He had spent the morning at the kids entertainments, games etc. Then played tennis or something, then gone in the pool and then to the beach - (lifeguards there). He'd also played football with his new friends and when we went for a drink in the bar he was at the youngsters disco next door.
Self catering yes, but they either seemed to have a barby or use the restaurants on site or walk to the town two mins away. And if you go by car you could always return via Disneyland? Hotels ain''t that expensive - Travelodge type (with restaurant though) for about £30-£40 for a room per night, probably £50 for a family of four. If you want better weather go further south - La Rochelle or Les Landes (fantastic beaches for surfing and also lakes for windsurfing, boating, swimming etc) and return via Fururoscope which is brilliant and needs at least two days. I suggest sites near the sea 'cos in my experience a beach will keep kids endlessly amused. Think the site name my brother stayed on was Point St Gilles - try a look for a website.
And if you have your car fill up any space with wine on the way back!
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"and return via Fururoscope"
or even Futuroscope !!
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Hi,
Thanks to all of you so far for your advice. Since I kind of have an interest in this too, I thought I'd add my tuppence worth.
Whilst not being a particularly well-seasoned traveller, I certainly have a lot more experience than Rob in this, having left these shores several times. I am a sun-lover, but he is not, so wherever we go will have to be a compromise weatherwise (ie not too hot).
However, I am utterly phobic about typical Brit touristy type places, and would rather spend a fortnight locked in my own toilet than endure a holiday in one of those. My ideal would be to find a place where we could just live like the locals do for a while, rather than having to abide with tattoo-bearing, Union Jack vest-wearing British lager louts wherever we go. That is why I am keen to go somewhere inland, and avoid beachy places like the plague, although I hear what is being said about the kids enjoying them etc. So we need another compromise here.
Neither of us has had a very easy time of it over the last year or so, and I want any break we take to be as perfect as possible, because we really do need one. I see that it's likely we're going to end up doing self-catering, but I am a little worried about that because I have that 'It's Mum's holiday too' feeling creeping up on me. I certainly don't want to spend the time cooking and cleaning too much, otherwise, as above, I might as well just lock myself in the loo here (not that I cook in the loo very often).
Anyway thanks again for all your thoughts - it has given us much to think about.
HF
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Try the western Costa del Sol from say Estepona to Sotogrande (latter VERY expensive!)- you will find a definite absence of the "Terror molinos" UK louts and the weather is just as good. Inland try Casares for a delightful "white village" only 20 minutes from the afore-mentioned coastal region.
I live thereabouts - get there before the usual culprits discover it! Mail me for specific advice if required
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HF & RTB
Here are my thoughts on your holiday. As suggested by other posters the USA is without doubt the best for holiday value, but if as Rob says you dont want to go there, here is my other Idea.
Friend of mine had a caravan on a haven holiday site in France. (they got divorced so we cant use it now :()
The site is in south west France in the Charent Maritime region., thats about 70 miles North of Bordeux. That part of the coast is gorgeous, between La Rochelle (has the best aquarium I know) and Royan. Place called La Palmyre. Super region, lots to go and see, its a mostly french resort so not full of lager louts. Eating out in france is cheap, if you stick to the fix price menus.
The camp site is mixed as a lot of french people have bought caravans on it, tho it can be a bit noisy and crowded near the pool area.
The weather in that region is usually very good without being baking hot, tho being on the Atlantic coast it can be variable.
Its an 10-12 hour drive from the chunnel, 6-8 hours from the brittany ports. One of the cheapo airlines was doing cheap flghts to la Rochelle
The moules and frittes in that area can not be beaten........
Had two wonderful holidays there and would gladly go back.
www.uk.haveneurope.com/choosingus/parcs/vendee/Les.../
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>>>>try Charlie's Steak House for THE best steak in the world (and I have eaten in 52 countries - cue where to find a better steak from Growler ;-).
Until two months ago I would have agreed with you, being a Charlie's fan for a long time, then I visited the Hog's Breath Cafe in Darwin, Australia. The steak needed its own plate, the veggies another one and the salad a third. I have never known a steak melt in the mouth, I swear this one did, I would kill for another one, it was magnificent. Who'd be a vegetarian?
Must keep this motoring and there is no doubt it was a great vacation (I shall be back there next month) except my Ford Falcon let me down, The passenger side front door lock failed right out in the woop-woop about 450 km from anywhere and the door couldn't be closed. Crept into gas station eventually with mate holding door closed. Guy comes out in mangled bush hat and grubby shorts laughing his head off. "b***** oath mate them Falcons all do that, third one this year!", rolled down the window and tied the door to the pillar with duct tape.
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"tattoo-bearing, Union Jack vest-wearing British lager louts wherever we go."
Not encountered one in any resort down the west coast of France in the last ten years - mainly because there don't seem to be the typical package holidays to the resorts which seem to be very family orientated. Think the same is true of most holiday resorts in Europe - there are only a few that attract this type. We even went to a couple of very popular Costa Brava resorts last summer (to find the sun - 2002 was not a good year weatherwise in France!) and had some pleasant evenings out without encountering lager louts. It seems to be a peculiarly British and German low life problem restricted to a few well known places at the height of the season. Even so, my daughter (far too sensible for her age!)went with some mates to a "lager lout" resort on Crete last year and said she had a great time because they stayed away from one or two streets and had a quiet holiday, dining out in the evening, in local restaurants with local food at cheap prices - By the way, if you want to avoid the really hot sun, Brittany sounds ideal for you!
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Thanks to all of you who have taken the time to post your very helpful and useful comments.
The current thiking is Tuscany, but we haven't investigated prices yet, so that may change! Still, we could always give Tony Blair a ring. He always seems to be able to get a nice villa at cheap prices ;-)
Cheers
Rob
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